The Indian/Chinese IQ puzzle

There was no fucking ukranian refuge in ice age, some moron introduce this idea and the other morons just copy and paste.

I trust any following this screed can hear the shrieking of the little Chinaman as he forces paleohistory into his preferred shape.

Uklainian LEFUGE AREUHH?? Some MAW-WAN introduce dat n otha MAW-WANS jes COPY-PAYSS’!

COPY-PAYSS’!!! MOTHA!@#$@%!!!

Christ, now I have to watch South Park. “Why u open SHITTY SUSHI next to my SHITTY WOK??!!”

This blog is living proof of the stupidity of racism

This blog proves why racists are stupid.
Just look at the all the speculations with haplogroups they come up with to fulfill their own satisfaction.

I am going to write in a manner so that even the less informed person should be able to understand.

Basically the only scientifically acceptable evidence we have right now gives a broader picture of the original migration of the human race. We all originated somewhere in Africa and we moved from their along different branches.
To understand, watch a documentary like this one called the “The Journey of Man”
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nBJDGzzrMyQ

There are at least half a dozen documentaries like the above one. Just to name a few you can also watch:
The Incredible Human Journey
The Human Family Tree
In Search Of Adam
The Real Eve

Basically, we all came from Africa. All non-Africans share a common ancestry as little as 60-70 thousand years back and all human beings in general share a common ancestry as little as 150 thousand years ago. Here is a rough idea map of early man migration.

Notice the word EARLY. We can’t tell much about recent migration(such as if “Aryan” migration actually occurred, the reason is recent intermixing )

So we are all Africans. This includes the Chinese too, where they are usually brainwashed to believe other things.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oQJzhFGuoHg

And how do we know this? There are basically two main ways. One is to look at the Y chromosome and the other is to look at the mt-DNA. Y chromosome is passed from father to father, so it gives paternal lineages and similarly mt-DNA gives the maternal lineage. What we actually look for in this y-chromosome are patterns of mutations or markers which these guys are calling haplogroups - which is the technical term.

The thing is, by looking at the overall patterns of distribution of markers along various ethnic groups in various geographic locations one can only get a broader picture of migration like shown in those documentaries(because people have intermixed for long), which is why speculations of realtively recent events like what is made in this blog are useless self-pleasing speculations, nothing more. Moreover, it appears that even the data doesn’t match from one person to another.

There is another reason why classifying human beings into races and treating them like different breeds of dogs doesn’t make sense. Consider this - the genetic difference that exists between two nearby groups of chimpanzees in neighbouring forests is more than the genetic difference found within the entire human race. And if anything, dogs should be much more diverse than chimps.
The reason for this fact is that human beings came terribly close to extinction. At one point there were less than 2000, possibly much less, human beings living in Africa. And the group that left Africa and gave rise to all non- Africans were even less in number -around 100 probably. Compare the chimps- their numbers never dropped below 20,000 and their population never increased as fast as humans. Which basically translates to- we are an incredibly close group.

Some like C.M are just plain nuts. Others like matt says that they are just curious about genetics (like me), but in reality he too cannot come out of certain racist assumptions. These people have just convinced themselves about some kind of strong relation between certain mutations and intelligence based on certain intuitive feelings developed on the basis of limited observations.
However, if you just think about it a bit it doesn’t make any sense.

Firstly, These markers appeared randomly as human beings branched out from one location to another. For example , if a “white skin” mutation occurs in a small group/branch, all subsequent branches will have white skin. However, very soon each of these branches will acquire many more new mutations and will further branch and mutate. As a result this small similarity of white skin gets overshadowed by other new dissimilar features to call “white skin” a race.

Secondly, The human species is too recent to have developed significant genetic differences.

Thirdly, It is possible for different genotypes to give rise to similar phenotypes. There are such examples in humans as well. One example is lactose tolerance(milk digestion) in adults. Majority are lactose intolerant- for example, lactose tolerance is extremely rare among east-asians. It is, however, found in certain groups. Two such examples are in northern europeans and eastern africans. Both obtained lactose tolerance independently and at different times(both when they started cattle rearing). So, if you apply this to intelligence, it is entirely possible that one branch of a certain haplogroup is more similar in intelligence to another branch of another haplogroup than to another branch of it’s own haplogroup.

And another thing this lactose example shows is how stupid the concept of race is. For example, one can easily build a lactose tolerant “race” instead of “white” race. But no, we don’t look for that - what we look for are certain common sense notions that appeals to us usually related to external appearances.

And another thing this lactose example shows is how stupid the concept of race is. For example, one can easily build a lactose tolerant “race” instead of “white” race. But no, we don’t look for that - what we look for are certain common sense notions that appeals to us usually related to external appearances.

There are even more reasons to believe that racists are stupid. One reason is that they tend to believe in genetic determinism- that is, what you become is written in your genes and you can’t change. Forget skills and abilities, even physical traits aren’t completely “determined” by genes. Enter epigenetics. Each of the cells in your body have exactly the same DNA. Then how come your eyes are different from ears or tongue? The answer lies in epigenetics. The so called genes only do things like producing proteins or enzymes. But whether they actually produce that protein can be turned on and off using epigentic codes. The cells in different tissues are different because different genes are turned on and off in different kinds of cells. However, epigenetics isn’t predetermined at birth. The epigenome constantly interacts with with environment. It’s like a medium through which genes and environment interact. Even physical activities and psychological factors like stress can alter epigenome. And epigenome is the reason why identical twins tend to become more and more different as they grow up.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AV8FM_d1Leo
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fj4d-9Jgl6g
And some epigenetic changes, especially during puberty and pregnancy can span sevral generations.
Watch the documentary “Ghost In The Genes” for better understanding.

There is also some evidence found in certain organisms where the mutation rates can speed up under environmental stress in order to adapt. There are actually mutator genes which can turned on-off with response to environment. There is still a lot to understand about evolution, but one thing these things like epigenetics tell us is how important the environmental factors are.

And If you note how genes and environment interact, it is actually meaningless to assert something like a “percentage” to heritability of genes. Because not only is it impossible to provide an exactly identical environment, but different environments may be better for different individuals. Like pointed out earlier, environment and experience are two very different things.

And lastly, I will touch upon yet another stupid assumption by racists -  which is that IQ is somewhat unchangeable and that it is actually very important.Here is a link to an excellent article:
http://www.newyorker.com/arts/critics/books/2007/12/17/071217crbo_books_gladwell?printable=true
The article just flat out destroys both of the above claims.
In India, for example, educated people usually first encounter IQ type tests only after school. No wonder that some old childhood measurements aren’t that high. There are plenty of people who increase their scores in those kind of tests massively over a period of time.
IQ tests that are verbal tend to rely on vocabulary, which relies of knowledge and are culturally biased.
But even those that aren’t, the kind of progressive matrices used to measure Chinese IQ,also tend to rely on knowledge of abstract pattern. the thing with abstract patterns is however that you have to do some mental calculations or transformations before you can match a pattern. That’s why abstract knowledge coupled with working memory is a very good predictor of IQ. Abstract knowledge can always be increased with experience. For working memory, you need to train it like muscles and eat good food.
Moreover, these IQ test questions aren’t very consistent. Often the same question can be answered in two different ways by thinking along two different lines. So whatever IQ is, it’s definitely not a measure of some kind of innate qualitative thinking.

And also remember that the most important part of human evolution isn’t the bigger brain, there are other mammals with bigger brains, rather it’s the fact that they can communicate verbally(vocal chord) and use two hands with an opposable appendage(the thumbs). The evolution of the vocal chord and thumbs is what led to bigger brains because of greater intellectual stimulation.
And who knows, perhaps it is possible to teach even chimpanzee calculus if we can just communicate with them properly.

While I have exposed the stupidity of racism, I am sure racists will still exist because human stupidity is infinite and that is what is sad.

This blog is living proof of the stupidity of racism

The blog is alive?

the genetic difference that exists between two nearby groups of chimpanzees in neighbouring forests is more than the genetic difference found within the entire human race.

Anchoring. -1% genetic difference is all that’s necessary to result in phenotypic differences, which also have gross results in modern social contexts, specially adapted to accommodate one or another type, not concurrently.

Secondly, The human species is too recent to have developed significant genetic differences.

Your breakfast was recent. Two and a half million years cannot be described as “recent” even grammatically. 

Majority are lactose intolerant-

Majority does not carry the gene for lactose tolerance. Does not mean they cannot consume dairy. Witness south Indians — gene absent, but they love curd.

You could have saved yourself time by simply stating your belief that “there is no such thing as the white race”.

I completely agree with the above two posts. After all skin color is just one single mutation and it varies all around the world. It is possible for different mutations like lactose tolerance to occur in different parts of the world. After all life might just be a hologram anyways.  I guess the whole idea of race is something that has been created as a way to compete for natural resources.  Our overly materialistic society is what is giving life to these ideas as people need to reduce competition based on social status, skin color, gender, nation origin etc. Maybe society should place more importance on living in harmony with nature.

@anon / uh

I don’t think you even understood what I was trying to say.
BTW, human beings as a species are AT MOST 250 thousand years old, not 2.5 million years. You are probably talking about the genus homo, all of whose branches other than modern human beings has died out. And all living human beings can be traced to common ancestry only about 150 thousand years ago, even less for non-africans.

@matt

I am glad that you agree.
BTW, I think the general consensus is that there are more than one genes involved in producing the skin colour. And there are probably epigentic factors involved as well - take tanning for example. ( or take the fact that red heads use the same pigment in their hair as people in general do in their lips.)

@racism is stupid

I don’t have time right now to discuss all of your point and it would take quite a long time to point out the misinterpretations, half-truths and omissions in your posts however let me point our this; You obviously know VERY little about social evolution.

But forget direct biological arguments.

There is overwhelming sociological evidence that ‘diverse’ societies are worse places to live in and that maximally homogeneous societies are those with the highest levels of social-capital, trust and the fewest social pathologies.

It is not an accident that Denmark and Japan, for two examples, have excellent scores on the quality of life scale. In fact these relationship hold within nations also: in the USA the most homogeneous states score much higher on social-capital etc. It is a robust empirical observation.

This is not my assertion about the superiority/inferiority of any particular ethnic/cultural group rather it would also hold if little green men with 200 IQs were the minority/source of diversity.

People do not want to live in overtly diverse societies with ever more socio-cultural cleavages that have deep and potentially explosive political consequences (do you know the history of Indian partition for example?).

I would never wish to be anywhere near to being in the non-majority group in my own society. This wish has nothing to do with vulgar racism and everything do to with political and sociological realities.

To this anon uh

yet another fucking moron who is a stupid middle aged old man, thinking he knows it all, including matter of science, you fucking stupid moron, I am a man of science, unlike you fucking retarded old man! I know what I am talking about, but maybe I am wasting my time to try to explain things to a fucking moron who would not understand it anyway.

You stupid old man! Solving things of diverse topics is easy for me, including where the indo-european speakers came from (anatolia).

Look at the fucking shitty country you are from, it’s full of morons and idiots, they can’t even run their own country, of course it’s full of greedy old men stealing and engage in fraud. yeah. The reason why your sorry little country is such a mess because democracy is a sham, it should be called oligarchy instead (rule by rich people) but of course you are too stupid to understand this. No wonder why western culture is crap!

Watching “southpark” is for morons and you are one of them!

I can beat the crap out of you easily, old man.

thsi moron anon uh stupid old man living in his fantasy world, watching “southpark”...no wonder this stupid idiot is clueless.

remember moron, I am from undefeated China, not from your useless colonies. Wed on’t give a fuck about america and the west and that’s the truth, ask any Chinese about that and they won’t even know what’s the capital of england, so insignificant is europe.

we can stick our middle finger into the face of america and americans know that.
Fuck america!

I mean what’s is it like for europeans to be bossed around by americans in the same fashion as auxiliaries fighting american wars. In case of taiwan crisis I hope that americans will caome to the rescue of taiwan ordering their europeans to come along, we will crush you like insects!

useless fucking americans with your worthless dollar, the whole country is just a concept, stealing all the land from the indians, and these stupid laowei want to say something about “tibet”.
Yeah hand back the land to the indians and we can start talking about “tibet” or “taiwan”.

fucking shit americans, nuking you from here to eternity is the only right thing to do for this planet.

Only the indians are entitled to america, you build up the country with its infrastructure, well break it all down and give the land back to indians before you start to whine about immigration of mexicans and other people.

Hand the land back to the indians and then go back to the place of your ancestors. Then we can talk about “tibet” and “taiwan”.

Or better give back alaska to the eskimos or give back at least half of “usa” to the indians.

I have a better idea, maybe everybody should go back to their ancestral lands, australians go back to the london jails, “americans” go back to sicily, ireland and greece etc.

Brilliant idea, let’s all go back, black “americans” go back to nigeria and “american"jews go back to israel.

america should not exist.

remember moron, I am from undefeated China, not from your useless colonies. Wed on’t give a fuck about america and the west and that’s the truth

China has a couple decades of progress and prosperity after centuries of FAIL and that’s all they need to get their Middle Kingdom mojo back.

China is a seething mass of hundreds of millions of men with inferiority complexes, a historically unprecedented subset of whom will never get laid due to structural imbalances in their demographic profile.

I’ve got a smart idea. Let’s borrow a shit ton of money from them then stiff them on it, hand our entire military-industrial infrastructure over to them, have our most pathetic losers pick off enough of their women to refocus their sexual frustration in our direction, then load up our military with a motley assortment of foreign mercenaries, bumbling negroes, homosexuals, and assorted perverts and freaks.

What could possibly go wrong?

Fortunately, the Chinese government appears to be led by men a good deal wiser than this CM idiot, though I don’t doubt that he does represent a sizable contingent of the men in the street.

Anyway, we must all be eternally grateful for Deng’s one-child policy. China’s population will grow smaller in the future, though the sheer population imbalance is so great that China will become the world’s dominant power, especially if white men keep building up their economy for them (if Lister really understood the force of his own anti-Hayekian critique, he would be directing his fire at the theoretical assumptions behind tolerance of this suicidal aspect of economic globalism - lowering short term labor costs at the expense of long term national security, parasiting off a secure future, as it were).

this CM idiot

You’re being way too generous to him Leon!

a historically unprecedented subset of whom will never get laid due to structural imbalances in their demographic profile.

Maybe not.

In my neighborhood is a Chinese engineer who returned from Angola, and his wife is a black girl. However, she’s one of those very pretty high-end black girls. She’s very slender and not one of those fat auntie types. Her skin also isn’t the kind of oily/greasy black but rather black-brownish and more brown. They have two children, about five or six years old, twin boys.

http://www.chinasmack.com/2011/pictures/chinese-men-with-black-women-african-wives.html

The one-child policy may not have actually worked as well as believed.

There was a report on Al Jazeera which can be seen on YouTube about how when China started its one-child policy 30 years ago, they selected one of their cities as a control group for a secret experiment to see what would happen if families had the freedom to have more than one child: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s9kdQLQYT5w

They found that the population in that city has actually grown at a slower rate than the national average.

The control city also has a more even gender balance than the national average.

Lol   the chinese are smarter—thats why they make stuff on the factory floor pushing buttons on imported automated machines that Indians happened to program working in a office drinking quality coffee.

You know why White people don’t mind calling you smart? cause your busy doing their manual labor for them and then giving them the money you earned so they can blow it on coke and pussy—gotta keep the help content!

I forgot though, Indians are really crappy engineers/techs and the only reason they are hired is to drive prices down because the really smart White engineers are too proud to work for that type of pay and instead flip burgers—a process that could be automated if only someone with engineering skills was around…0.o                

Seriously though—-White American people are lucky that their military/industrial power complex has some love for them and actively tries to redistribute advantage in multiple indirect forms—not really true for other societies.

“Lol the chinese are smarter—thats why they make stuff on the factory floor pushing buttons on imported automated machines that Indians happened to program working in a office drinking quality coffee. “

That’s right.  Programming is Indian’s forte.  Bow to the IT superpower:

India, the world’s IT Superpower