The Indian/Chinese IQ puzzle

I’m an Indian and I find the average I.Q given for Indians as reasonable.  The Indian immigrants in North America and Europe do have a higher mean average I.Q because of their educational background and achievement: without an appreciable I.Q one can’t score the right SAT or GRE score to be eligible in the first place to study in western universities and eventually become their citizens.  However, in the Gulf regions the average I.Q for Indians could only be marginally higher than in India because most of them are unskilled or semi-skilled workers.  Having said that, their children with better education do have a ‘flynn effect’ in that they have higher I.Qs. On the whole, I believe, the current Indian I.Q would be slightly higher than 81. let’s say about 85.  With regard to the Northern Far East countries such as China, Japan and Korea having a supposedly very high I.Q of abouit 110, there are many sceptics now.  For instance, the celebrated writer Malcolm Gladwell asserts that the vaunted Chinese I.Qs are not real, in that, the sampling was not done objectively, but in order to get a ‘good leve’ the tests were administered to elite school children (comparable to the English Medium students of India). Malcolm goes on to say in his book “Outliers” that the chinese I.Q only equals that of Indian or the sub-continent average score of 85 or thereabouts.  This shows that there needs to be a total revamp in the study and fresh tests should be given to Far North Easterners; until such a time we should not include them in any race, intelligence related topics.  As far as Indians are concerned, there is a tendency among many especially the upper caste to get too sensitive on this issue of I.Q.  They bring in sanskrit, vedas, ayurveda and some selective inventions to prove they are very intelligent.  There is a difference between what one believes and what one is.  It is time for Indians to come to terms with their I.Q which on an average is about 85.  It’s not very difficult to find it out: see the Nobel Prize winners.  We Indians have fewer than 5 while the Jews have 168, and the whites cumullatively over several hundreds.  The good news is that even with a moderate I.Q of 75 a community can be successful in all aspects of life.  This is more true with us Indians because we have an above average E.Q that makes us one of the most adaptable and successful human beings on planet earth.

Interesting article. Hilarious comments.
I’m a Jew(Ashkenazi)/Indian(Brahmin) American myself and I’ve worked for an NGO in India for many years.

Vanhanen got it right about the Indians but I doubt the accuracy of his stats as far as far easterners go.
I believe the Japs, Chinese and Koreans attribute their development to their work ethics more than IQ.
I don’t know what kind of sampling method was used to arrive at an average for these nations but I’m of the firm belief that the results are flawed.

I would put the Chinese behind white western/northern Europeans, the Koreans and Japs would score a little higher on an average but they would most definitely be more clustered around the average score where as the white population would have much greater variance on the higher side and not accounting for such spikes, the average would probably drop a few points and still be higher than the Chinese average.

The average Indian is the peasant, the farmer, the construction worker and the cattle rearer. These classes would make up 50-60% of the Indian population and they have one of the lowest IQs in the world.

IQ in India is class dependant with Brahmins and other upper classes scoring similar to a random sample of western Europeans and the Indian tribals at the lowest end having a similar profile as seen with the sub-Saharan African populace.

Good day!

Seltzer sounds about right.

@Seltzer and Leon Haller: clueless Jews. You’re no whites. There is no stat on Ashkenazi jew iq. The only one reliable is jew 94. really pathetic.

what utter bullshit!!

These iq tests are the results of so called european eugenics, aryan theory etc etc, how superior white man conquered lands, this is not intelligence, first of all

Whites population where classed as barbarian tribes, and have shown such traits, from the slave empires, of rome, britain, france, etc, to the plunder of india, africa, china, etc, to the forced conversion of others, from the dark ages, fro, the church to restricting sceience

these iq tests are built on a western format, they will always show whites to have higher iq, but lets get into history, the basic fundamentals of maths, sceience, were achieved in india and china, its well known that pythagorus studies in india, its well known that greeks would send students into india, the first known evidence for well planned cities are in india, the first evidence for agrilculture is from india not central asia, the oldest civilisatons are india and china, the difference is 300years.

for 300years, both india and chinese development was halted, for india it was two invasions of central asia, by muslims and then christians, via the sea, this absolute genocide and plunder of india, took india into poverty, its destroyed it ancient civilisation, and all this plunder and wealth was then transferred to europe, in america, a land wiped clean of the natives, whites used slavery to create the basic foundation in which white european soceity in america live in today, this free labour, created a country which has never happened before in human history, a slave population ge4neration after genraetion condemned to work and built the foundation in which whites would operate, the plunder of the east, the hijacking of trade roots, all these events which took place in the last 3-400years gave europeans a headstart withthe enrichment of wealth and knowledge form india, and at the same time india went into a deep depression for almost 400years, only know we are rising out of it, as is china.

So whites iq is down to barbarian tactics in conquering wealthy profitable lands under their control, and plunder, this accumlative wealth over400years, has steadily improved the lives of europeans and at the same time directly condemned africa, india, china, americas into poverty.

Thats why today most of the worlds problems stem from european rule and intervention,,

The most intelligent people on earth, are the indian and the chinese, the two oldest cultures on earth,

The indian never morally seeked conversion or lands of others, they where fulfilled, india and china where light years ahead of europe, information went from east to west as did wealth, even the core elements of calculus have now known to be from india, which was taken back to europe by jesuit priests…....

IQ IS Determined by genetics AND MOST importantly enviroment. The europeans have a very basic shallow culture, which is representative of their civilisation, the history of european can be classsed in two parts, the first the enslaving , conquering barbaric chapters, from the days of rome, to british empire, to nazism, and 2nd chapter is one of now, today, where the wealth of those previous events has created a stable productive enviroment for europeans which they have had now for at least 200years, the wealth taken from india and china, aafrica, has now paid dividends, but compare the ancient texts of the asians (indain chinese) with europeans, their is no contest, the east is always and has always been the most intelligent and morally guided land on earth…you just need to look into the firt chapter of europeans to soo the ironic aspects of being labelled intelligent.

Lest it be said that only WNs harbor negative feelings towards other groups (or better, groups they consider “other”), indulge in specious historical arguments (or simply lie) and so on, we present you Hindutva.

There are many comments. I read a selection of them.

From what I know and what I can state here is that the Indian government has never officially stated that we are in a competition with any other country in any field - whether it is the economy, the military, culture, sports, or political influence in the world. I understand why it is natural for people to compare India and China. But I think such people are wasting their time. Maybe there is not much going on in their lives.

There is no democracy versus communism, no race to the moon contest here such as the one between Russia and the USA during the Cold War era.

One thing though is clear. India is modernizing. If you visited India 10, 15 or more years ago you’ll be struck by the changes that have taken place. There will be more of the same in the next 10, 15 or more years. India is not doing it because some other country is doing it and it is not doing it to overtake some other country. Modernization is a natural process. And India is going about it in its own way and at its own pace.

Psychologists are like stockbrokers and seminarians.
Mostly third-stringers blowing smoke for a
living. These people probably fall in the IQ range 75 to 85.

Very stupid comment. there are many brilliant psychologists.

Someone with an IQ of 75-85 would not be able to get through an accredited doctoral program.

http://urbanlegends.about.com/od/horrors/a/eating_babies.htm

Hi, I am from Belgium, Europe, and the above comments have convinced me that IQ is strongly influenced by environmental factors. Before I started reading them, my own IQ was about 50 points higher than it is now.

I do believe certain genes are associated might have an association with men carrying certain haplogroups. If you notice Europe has about 50% R y dna mixed with J2, J1, E3, I2a, I1a, N3, T.  Genetic pools that have males contributing from R or J might be smarter.  However, not research has been done. It doesn’t really matter that muuch.  If you notice most of the male contribution for East Asia comes from O y dna, which is pretty homogenous.

Haplogroup Distribution for India - R1a, R2, J2, O, L, H, very little R1b, Q, F*, E, G
Haplogroup Distribution for Europe(varies in different parts of Europe) - R1a, R1b, I1a, I2a, N3, J2, E3b, T, G
Haplogroup Distribution for East Asia - O (mostly O), N, D

Uhm…lol.
1. I’m an Indian.
2. Most of my classmates(in India) are really smart. But that may probably be because mine is supposedly a very good college.(We have to pay to get into it though…no scholarships or such…)
3. There are a few people in my class from villages. They are here on quotas or something. In the beginning, they had a very hard time understanding English and other subjects. We usually have these tests on ‘Analytical ability’ and they scored the least in the entire class.
But now, after nearly 3 years, their scores(mostly IQ) improved rapidly…hmm…one of them even became the second topper in our class.
I can’t speak for everyone, but I think education does play an important role in the ‘intelligence level’ of a person..o.O
Also, there are so many different languages in India. On what basis do they test?? They can’t ask questions in English since it isn’t our mother tongue. Not all people know Hindi either,so its ruled put as well. Not everyone is educated…so what exactly are they going to ask these kind of people?
And yeah, Chinese are quite smart..I think? Uh…but can’t know anything for sure.(Due to their government and all).
Why is everyone discussing this topic so much anyway??
It all depends on hard-work(or that’s what my dad said at-least…hehe ^^) Its his way of saying me that I’m gonna end up nowhere if I don’t work hard, no matter what my IQ level is(which happens to be 141…mwuahaha..ain’t I smart…*sigh* Just kidding…Actually Im just so lazy that I get terrible ranks(yeah, we have ranks in my stupid, stupid college) >.<
Uhm…yeah, so where was I? Yup, as I was saying(or writing, in this case), as long as we have hard-working citizens excelling in the professions they undertake, we’ve got nothing to worry about(well, other than the corrupt politicians, poverty, external terrorism, in-equitable distribution of property..and…omigosh…I could go on forever…-_-)
*scratches back of the head*
And all of you people talking this way makes me feel so dumb. NOT!
To all my fellow Indians(who are mostly elder to me)——> Jeez people! Suck it up! What are you trying to prove my saying that we have much higher IQ. Does it make a difference? I guess not! *sighs again* Get out of this site and get yourselves educated even more( and that’s exactly what Im gonna do after I complete writing this..gosh..I’m such a hypocrite…). Just stop talking about what our great-great-great-great-great….actually I’ve lost count of how many greats are there….grandfathers have done and start doing something for the nation(I’m hella patriotic, don’t you think?)
To all the other nationals(who are mostly elder to me as well)—-> Well, hello there! Eh…actually, I haven’t got anything to say to you people. Just keep insulting us and doing….uh..well..whatever you were doing..). It actually tends to make us work harder and strive for the better! So, don’t worry…you’re all doing us a favor(just in case you were wondering, that’s how it works on India). xD
Nah, I was kidding! *shows the peace sign*
Hmphhh..anyway, now I better go and study or else my mom’s gonna skin me alive(not really…gah!). We all know how Indian parents can get…o.O *shudders*
Buy-Bye.
Have fun people!(like I even care)
A 16 year-old Indian girl who just about hates the Indian education system and who is also an Engineering/Law aspirant who loathes the subject Chemistry from the bottom of her huge(Yeah…I’m such a kind person, didn’t you know?) heart!
~~~~~Peace~~~~~~
After seeing this post, I kinda started having a love-hate relationship with this world…!And people in general.
Omigosh! I am turning into a Misanthrapologist…xO!
I’m outta here!! xD

I hate this stupid Ipad and this stupid spell-checker!
My typos which turned into entirely different words in my above post…—->
*trying to prove ‘by’ saying…not ‘my’
*that’s how it works ‘in’ India, not ‘on’ India.
Bleuhhh…

Okay people! Accepted! We, Indians are dumb and have very low IQs! Happy?
Just quit the hating and racist stuff, ok?:/ World peace is an absolute necessity right now! We can’t afford a 3rd world war…=_=

@And_I_care_because?
Haha! Cool post! :D
I’m Indian too…and a girl as well…and 18 years…co-incidence much? ;D
By the way, I’m an Engineering student as well!! *Hi-five*
I’m a chemical Engineering student…which stream do you want to take up? Not an IIT aspirant, are u?
Where you from btw? x)
Good night!
Se7en.Girl

And I Care is a Southern Californian.

I felt my IQ dropping as I read And I Care ‘s comment.

20 million unemployed and underemployed people in the USA have the lowest IQ of any group anywhere in the world.

Care to elaborate anon?

After all is said and done, this site is really about airing personal prejudices and not about science or even pseudo-science.

Thanks for your pointless contribution there Amazed, a real breathtaking insight.