The Indian/Chinese IQ puzzle

I really what kind of an agenda the author has by flattering India. If nutrition gets better the Indians will get smarter. One could say the same thing for Africa! So what?

In http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_growth_1990–2007
You can see the growth rates between 1990-2007. Equatorial Guinea had the record with 29.03 percent per year (though it didn’t have a huge domestic market).

1.990 133.219.577
1.991 171.893.220
1.992 221.793.822
1.993 286.180.569
1.994 369.258.788
1.995 476.454.614
1.996 614.769.388
1.997 793.236.941
1.998 1.023.513.625
1.999 1.320.639.631
2.000 1.704.021.316
2.001 2.198.698.704
2.002 2.836.980.937
2.003 3.660.556.503
2.004 4.723.216.056
2.005 6.094.365.678
2.006 7.863.560.034
2.007 10.146.351.512

And it managed to grow 26.02 percent per capita annually but it is still not a miracle as the country is still very poor. But Norway at the 48th rank managed to grow 6.62 % annually though it doesn’t have a HUGE DOMESTIC MARKET (!) either. It is a miracle as Norway was already very wealthy.

As one of my Russian friend said Chinese are the most hardworking people physically that is why they are good in Kung Fu and in manufacturing jobs. where Indians are good in Yoga/Mediation and Software development and hence creative and intelligent. Richwine study proved it. Culturally once India ruled china (Buddhisam). Now due to west China has grown as they have transferred the technology and build the infrastructure for China. They proved that they are the most ungrateful people (not all Chinese, there are many good Chinese people I know) on the planet earth. See the invasion of Tibet. Since you lost the debate, you resorted to dealing in a filthy manner about cleaning ass etc. You do not deserve to be here, go to some pornographic sights and continue your discussion there, there may be people in your category there. Our discussion ends here as you could not cut any of my points and also diverted the discussion in a desperate way to fitly subjects by side tracking from the main subject. Since you are not a representation for Chinese people why I should continue with you. Any way I am posting one of my published articles here not for you but for others.

IS PERSONALITY TRAITS BEYOND GENOME

This is obviously a wonderful subject to debate and there are few critics in favoring genotypes and the others against it. The recent studies favored IQ in correlation to nueroplastry especially in childhood, stressing on envi-ronment and efforts rather than genotypes. It will be more appropriate to choose the word stereotypes instead of defining as genotypes. It is true that the early models supports genotypes in favor of IQ, the new model emphasize more on neuroplastry which happens predomi-nantly in the childhood because of the variance in those periods compared to matured ones. We are not yet in an ideal multiracial and multicultural society to assure the validity of genotypes. Even the hapmap project which carried out is basically intended for researchers to use the data for the studies pertaining to diseases rather than studying the IQ gaps in races. Another notable factor in hap map project was that the samples are extremely small Phase 1 290 , phase 2 290 and phase 3 1030,. There is no way to find the educational and environmental factors are identical as the identity of the individuals are kept as classified. More over for the sustenance of hereditary traits there should be halo types which can only happen in small groups. That is why main land Chinese have a less average IQ than a Hong Kong or Singaporean Chinese? How come African Americans has a wide gap of IQ variance with African blacks? These are the questions to be addressed. The counter argument can be the smartest has moved out from their home land, but they have not demonstrated the high IQ what they recently have with their parents who actually migrated earlier which marks as daylight that environment factors projects out always. Another objection can be that since they have migrated to other countries and if the race mixing is not much dominant then there can be more halo types, but again the time frame is extremely small to substantiate such arguments. This implies there is a strong correlation of the environments and efforts which boost once IQ and hence the gap which we see. Every ethnic group has their own social norms and set up even in a multicultural environment. The home grown terrorist are a typical example for such conclusions. By saying so I didn’t mean there is a genital factor which is favorable to IQ , the variance is genetical factors are obvious as no two DNA’s match, so such variance can be correlated to individuals with in the races to individuals among the races. Results of the US election of 2008 is an eye opener as Obama being a black. The younger and educated voters favored Obama unlike the older and less educated ones. so the racially biased category of people lies in the latter group. The same with racially biased IQ proponents too. In order to have a closer look we need to get hold of some elementary knowledge about genetics and it’s role even though we are very early in the science of genetics, still it is worth discussing it here. The DNA in our cells are comprised of four chemical building blocks adenine, thymine, cytosine and guanine , abbreviated as A,T,C, and G.  There are more than 6 billion of these chemical bases combined together in a sequence to form 23 pairs of chromosomes which defines a single human cell. There 23 pairs which are contributed from the parents with each pair has a combination of one from the mother and the other from the father. These sequencing are instrumental in defining our physical traits, possibilities for genetical disorders and diseases. The genetical sequencing of different individuals is remarkably similar to hundreds of bases. The normal variations happen at about 1200 bases, on an average. One person might have an A at the location for G for another person or either an extra base or a missing one. Each distinct letter of a chromosomal region is known as an allele, and a collection of alleles in person’s chromosomes is called a genotype. The genetic differences in bases are known as single nucleotide polymorphisms or simply SNP’s pronounced as “snips” and are in an order of approximately 10 million SNP’s estimated to occur in the human genome. Since the researchers are unable to locate as on where is a particular gene resides in a chromosome which is responsible for say high blood pressure.  they have to do a round about method by using SNP’s as markers to identify the gene.  It is cumbersome to test all the 10 million common SNP’s. of a persons chromosomes instead they can compare the SNP’s of people who have high blood pressure with people without there by identifying the gene responsible for hypertension using that SNP pointer.  Also it has been noted that the genetic variants that are nearer each other tend to be inherited together. For example a set of people can have identical genetical variations around all the SNP’s in the chromosomal region surrounding a particular variant A instead of G at a given location in the chromosome. There regions of linked SNP’s are called halo types. These halo types can be seen in a given population with concentrations of different percentages as 55% have one type of halo type another with 30% and some with 8% and the rest can have a variety of less common type of halo types. These are spread across evenly with in races than among races. This again discredits the correlation of IQ advantage with particular races. Every race has an identical genome makeup of a 99.9 % only. The disparity is in halo types which are universally spread and hence the race and IQ correlations are a myth. American Jews were famous for their highest IQ which was now over took by Indians in the Richwine Study Indicates that race has nothing to do with IQ. Environments, efforts and halotypes which are spread across the races rather than within races indicate that IQ is tangible. Since this is the era of globalization such differences should be uprooted even in the embryo stage to build a peaceful multicultural society worldwide.

LOL, this guy thought that Astro and I are the same? Poor intuition!
Based on that post, he definitely seems to identify himself more with east-asians, but calls he is not one! It seems either he is a chinese trying to use a proxy, or may be he is some sort of half-breed.

I have considered another possibility and rejected it - which is that he is related to the blog and wants the blog to be alive, but I don’t think that’s the case - racist attitudes like his are common.

Astro, you are indeed right. Primitive men had larger brains. Also, math or physics majors, who have much higher IQs, actually don’t have that much larger brain.
More importantly, google “neurogenesis”. Recent research has shown that even human adults can grow new brain cells. London Taxi Drivers literally grow their brain size.

BTW, there are many computers that can score 160+ easily in an IQ test.
Perhaps you guys should know that during the development of AI it was found that knowledge and adaptability are far more crucial than the long detailed algorithms and computations. The reason why the best human chess players can go toe to toe with supercomputers is because humans are able to remember more patterns, even though they compute much less.

Strategy, About vocabulary - you will be surprised to know that the average educated indian knows 3, or at least 2, different languages. That’s 3x vocabulary.
Some schools give importance to Sanskrit, a difficult language - that’s 4x vocabulary.

Oh and let me remind you, 2.2 GHz quad core can easily be much faster than a 3.6 GHz single core pentium. So even if there was a case that chinese brains carry signals faster, it will not mean that they process more. But there is no solid proof for even that.

And you call us dirty because we defend our country? What kind of a dirty coward are you? you hide behind internet anonymity and curse another country that you know very little about.

Perhaps you should watch this:
David Suzuki destroys Rushton, the guy you racists cling to
http://www.youtube.com/watch?gl=US&feature=player_embedded&v=i9FGHtfnYWY

I have a lot of respect for the Chinese, but not racist bastards like you.
And yes, we Indians are happy with our normal life. If that hurts you so much, too bad.

And Astro, since you talk about genes and environmental effect, you might be interested in this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=we4ZzjKxFHM
Richard Lewontin breaks many heritability myths.
Also check out videos on EPIGENETICS to understand how genes and environment interact.

You lost the debate (as if there was any). I answered every question of yours in details and again and again you ask the same stupid questions. If you read my 622nd post there is no huge market advantage like your stupid 615th post claims so. You turn to the Richwine study though the Indians perform worse everywhere else except US. You should ask this to Lynn, not the author of this web site. As to the toilet paper just read the 17th post in this forum and the 20th post as a reply to that. Yes, that is exactly the typical character of the Indians like I observed in many other forums.

@Curious Indian,You came up with some good points, we must root out any racial morons whether it is Indians, Chinese or whites. I just watched the Suzuki / Rushton debate. Ruston totally lost. As Suzuki said Ruston should have been fired from the westen university. I don’t know how come Ontario government allowed and funded such morons with public money, Liberal party has to be blamed for this as they are in power in Ontario for some time. Did you noticed even Rushton admitted that 50% are environmental factors which catering to IQ score, see that makes the whole difference. This Rushton is another idiot, How could he became a professor of psychology, I dont know. He never considered the EQ which is a vital factor for enhancing the IQ, Cultural and religious factors enhances the EQ, not ethnicity. As you know racial people always have a lower IQ as well as EQ,  that is why they cant win a debate and will resort to filthy arguments. This Chinese guy initially came up with some good though common points which I refuted all of them, then he came up with p.c.i and cheap labor argument, due to his low IQ he cant even understand that with population p.c.i will come down. Or we need a very huge GDP. China is 3 times bigger than India in size and in resources so naturally the GDP will be more and hence in pci too in a INDIA VS CHINA scenario, though there are other factors. He skipped to respond to my quote.“U.K and Russia has a comparable GDP but why the pci of Russia is no where near to UK?.“population is the answer which he dont know or cant admit Cheap labor is only one of the factors, or else Africa should have been growing the most.?” no answer for this!!! . This guy could not even understand what I quoted “The population growth of India will turn out to be a boon as India will be still young in the work force and will maintain more or less the same growth in the long run with a bonus of a huge domestic market, even China will be handicapped in a later stage as they have restricted the population growth” What I said is that the population growth will turn out to be a boon (a luck) for India and will have a huge domestic market in the future in India itself and also a young work force” poor guy did not get it. As population grow the domestic market will also grow with in the country.  He couldn’t catch it. He claims he is an economist,  most probably a high school drop out for sure. It is very simple a person with high IQ can never be racist. Everyone knows that Brain has unlimited capacity, can store unlimited data unlike a computer. This stupid guy argues evolution will not produce anything which is not useful. How do evolution knows that we are going to use gadgets like computers to store data which is in a way depriving us to use the more potentiality of the brain as we are resorting to computers, stupid guy.” See David Susuki even being an east Asian origin, he is against such racial morons why because he is living in a multiracial society unlike this idiot may be from some rural province from China interested in toilet papers only. May be we should only deal with sensible Chinese fellows who are living in a multicultural society. Did you noticed his comments on toilet paper, filthy guy. I will watch the other videos later thanks for the link and dropping in.

The reaction time measures the period of the process of understanding, not the period of the electric signals in the brain. If the process is faster the electric signals should be faster. That is what she says so. She doesn’t say ‘as the electric signal are faster they understand faster’ but she says that as they understand faster their brains must have faster electric signals’. It seems you didn’t understand. In fact she says just the reverse of what you understood.))) If you read (I wouldn’t in fact advise as I know that you won’t understand) The G Factor of Arthur Jensen which is said to be the best book about the science of mental abilities in the history he approves that the reaction time is one of the biological correlates of g. One doesn’t need to be a neuroscientist to measure the reaction time. The psychologists also do it.

Africa has the youngest work force (!) and no luck. Not only the idiot writers of Wikipedia but even the MOST IDIOT people on earth know this. I read your stupid comments to laugh, not for anything else. But you are going very well, I suggest carry on writing tones of extremely idiot sentences so that the people can understand why there are lots of idiots in India and why the mean IQ is extremely low. You prove that India is just 81, not any more. You are a perfect Indian and you represent your country very well. As to Gordon’s lie in the 17th post it is not surprising to see the simplicity of the lie and that he even doesn’t think of changing his Indian name. Even lying requires some honor (!) and a little bit IQ. The Indians can’t have even that level.

By the way the reaction time is measured with milliseconds. They ask you a simple question and you give the answer in less than a second.

Yes, Astro, indeed you made some very valid points on topics such as p.c.i that he/she was unable to respond to.
And let me just point out another thing -  if you notice - Rushton, Jensen, Lynn, Linda Gottfriedson etc - they are all psychologists or social scientists. They are not qualified biologists, nor mainstream scientists as much as they would like to claim so.
Whereas if you notice the videos I posted - the likes of Suzuki, Lewontin - and others such as Graves, Luigi Sforza etc - most of them are geneticists or qualified biologists.

Sir Richard Feynman had spoken volumes about how psychology, social sciences and related fields are not exactly real sciences. They follow some scientific forms, but for the most part, these are “cargo-cult science” practiced by pseudo-scientists , often motivated by certain political agendas. And they end up INTIMIDATING people. He even compared psychiatrists with witch doctors.

To understand how they intimidate, you just have to look at the likes of Rushton. In his speeches, he will say that he has drawn his conclusions based on statistics. He will base his lectures on statistical concepts such as G-factor, which he claims is very highly heritable, without giving the slightest idea to normal people what this thing really means. He will just avoid saying they are complex.

However, if you ask a real statistician, they will tell you that this whole G-factor is nothing more than a STATISTICAL ARTIFACT.  The whole concept of g-factor is based on correlations. The idea is that the IQ questions which correlates best with other questions(answering one makes you likely to answer others) are the one with highest g-load. Then they use the concept of factor analysis to make a jump from correlation to make statements that imply causation.

The whole thing is a logical fallacy really and is based on cyclic logic. They have confused correlations with causation. In fact, an IQ test is SELECTED/RATED to be a good IQ test IF ONLY it CORRELATES with other IQ tests. Can you see the cyclic logic here?
In general, this g-factor is closely correlated to working memory. However, even working memory can be trained like muscles. Practicing games like dual-n-back has shown to improve it.
And get this - the FLYNN EFFECT IS STRONGEST on tests which are more g-loaded like the Raven’s progressive matrices and which also tend to be less culturally biased .

To understand better, I suggest you read a guy called Cosma Shalizi. You may also read an article called “Misuses of statistics in the study of intelligence” by Jack Kaplan.
In fact, one should question the very validity of IQ tests Jus because they are objective doesn’t make them valid.
Shalizi - he writes - If asked to continue the sequence “1, 1, 2, 3, 5”, most readers would recognize the Fibonacci sequence and say “8”. But there are infinitely many other sequences where the next number is 7 (e.g., pick the largest prime number less than or equal to the sum of the previous two numbers), or for that matter 11 (the smallest prime number greater than or equal to, etc.). Similarly, what Raven’s matrices test is not how well you can “deduce relations”, but how well you can find the patterns RAVEN LIKED— personally, I can solve such puzzles only by guessing what was going through the test-maker’s mind.

Feynman also points out the lack of importance of talent:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lr8sVailoLw

Apart from confusing correlation with causation, another reason why psychologist or social scientist find it hard to do real science is because they deal with what is known as complex systems. The human brain, the human society etc are complex systems. In complexity science there is a concept of EMERGENT PROPERTY. These are properties of the whole systems that are not found in the parts.  Intelligence is an emergent property. Something as a simple as a simple IQ score can’t determine something as complex as intelligence. It’s like trying to judge the health of a person with blood pressure alone.

Now I am quite liberal and I believe in having the freedom express your opinions and doing research, but Rushton is not a real researcher - he is a pseudoscientist funded by racist organizations.

————————————————

And Strategy, reaction time is by no means the same as processing power. It just measures how quickly you respond to something. The response itself may be preprogrammed.
An it is a hard thing to measure. For example, professional tennis players bypass the biological limits of reaction time by responding to the ball by following the opponents body movements.
Smilarly, while average digit-span is believed to be around 7 digits. By practicing properly for several years, one can extend the digit span to as high as 100 or even more. Similarly, a chess player can train himself to play bliindfold chess games. These are not general skills, but applies to very specific skills with a lot of practice. It’s called expert working memory, different from general working memory..

In general, the speed of decision making seems to depend on a substance called myelin. The more myelinated you brain connections are- the quicker you make decisions. however, the amount of myelination seems to be largely influenced by environment.
Not all parts of the brain are equally myelinated. The parts that you use more are myelinated more. Starting something like playing a musical instrument early may also result in greater myelination of the relevant connections.

And myelin may be a doubl-edged sword. While it may make you act fast, it may also make it harder to rewire the relevant connection - making you closed-minded or slave of a habit.

It is my fault to think that you and the idiot Astro are the same. It is quiet clear that you must be much smarter than that idiot. And it is a shame for you flattering that idiot. I know that correlations don’t need to be the causations but you should know that both in the social sciences and hard sciences the researches are made like this. For example in the countries which have the highest population growths and the lowest average age (they are the same) the economical growth rates are generally low. Economists have always thought that the population growth was the main reason. They thought that there was a correlation between the two. It is quiet related with Rushton’s r-K theory. The families which have more children have generally lower IQ. It goes the same for the nations and races. The testosterone hormones spend more energy and not much is left for the brain. Though I am quiet liberal and support the freedom of expression I don’t think there is anything wrong with what Rushton claims. Suzuki made one big mistake. He talked about the meaningless of race and then he again said that there was a greater diversity within a race than between 2 races. He denies the existence of race and says this.

As to the reaction time I don’t think it can be programmed unless you learn the type of questions before. And I think you can’t learn otherwise the reaction time would be meaningless. They ask a simple question related with IQ and you are supposed to answer correctly in less than a second. It is one of the correlates of g but not the g itself. Among all the subsets the vocabulary is said the have the highest g loading. What it means is the high scorer in the vocabulary test has the highest chance to do better in the other tests. Vocabulary has a lot to do with memory, not just understanding. In America all the enrichment programs like Head Start, Abecedarian Project, Perry Preshool, Milwaukee Project failed to increase the IQs of the children. The most expensive and the most successful program was Abecedarian and it was less than 5 points at the age of 15. IQ at childhood is quiet environmental but at adulthood it goes to its genetic orbit.

” Yes, Astro, indeed you made some very valid points on topics such as p.c.i that he/she was unable to respond to.
And let me just point out another thing -  if you notice - Rushton, Jensen, Lynn, Linda Gottfriedson etc - they are all psychologists or social scientists. They are not qualified biologists, nor mainstream scientists as much as they would like to claim so.
Whereas if you notice the videos I posted - the likes of Suzuki, Lewontin - and others such as Graves, Luigi Sforza etc - most of them are geneticists or qualified biologists.

Sir Richard Feynman had spoken volumes about how psychology, social sciences and related fields are not exactly real sciences. They follow some scientific forms, but for the most part, these are “cargo-cult science” practiced by pseudo-scientists , often motivated by certain political agendas. And they end up INTIMIDATING people. He even compared psychiatrists with witch doctors. “——-Curious Indian

***Perhaps you don’t need a scientist, natural or social, to point out what’s the obvious, unless of course one has a 2-digit IQ part from curious?

“To understand how they intimidate, you just have to look at the likes of Rushton. In his speeches, he will say that he has drawn his conclusions based on statistics. He will base his lectures on statistical concepts such as G-factor, which he claims is very highly heritable, without giving the slightest idea to normal people what this thing really means. He will just avoid saying they are complex.

However, if you ask a real statistician, they will tell you that this whole G-factor is nothing more than a STATISTICAL ARTIFACT.  The whole concept of g-factor is based on correlations. The idea is that the IQ questions which correlates best with other questions(answering one makes you likely to answer others) are the one with highest g-load. Then they use the concept of factor analysis to make a jump from correlation to make statements that imply causation.

The whole thing is a logical fallacy really and is based on cyclic logic. They have confused correlations with causation. In fact, an IQ test is SELECTED/RATED to be a good IQ test IF ONLY it CORRELATES with other IQ tests. Can you see the cyclic logic here?
In general, this g-factor is closely correlated to working memory. However, even working memory can be trained like muscles. Practicing games like dual-n-back has shown to improve it.
And get this - the FLYNN EFFECT IS STRONGEST on tests which are more g-loaded like the Raven’s progressive matrices and which also tend to be less culturally biased . “——-Curious Indian

*** The fact that no everyone (indeed not many) can be trained like Schwarznigger or Usian Bolt contradicts your claim that working memory can be trained like muscles. And working memory (rote learning) is not g even by a long shot.  The logical fallacy is what you’re claiming that g= working memory= trained. 

“To understand better, I suggest you read a guy called Cosma Shalizi. You may also read an article called “Misuses of statistics in the study of intelligence” by Jack Kaplan.
In fact, one should question the very validity of IQ tests Jus because they are objective doesn’t make them valid.
Shalizi - he writes - If asked to continue the sequence “1, 1, 2, 3, 5”, most readers would recognize the Fibonacci sequence and say “8”. But there are infinitely many other sequences where the next number is 7 (e.g., pick the largest prime number less than or equal to the sum of the previous two numbers), or for that matter 11 (the smallest prime number greater than or equal to, etc.). Similarly, what Raven’s matrices test is not how well you can “deduce relations”, but how well you can find the patterns RAVEN LIKED— personally, I can solve such puzzles only by guessing what was going through the test-maker’s mind.

Feynman also points out the lack of importance of talent:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lr8sVailoLw

Apart from confusing correlation with causation, another reason why psychologist or social scientist find it hard to do real science is because they deal with what is known as complex systems. The human brain, the human society etc are complex systems. In complexity science there is a concept of EMERGENT PROPERTY. These are properties of the whole systems that are not found in the parts.  Intelligence is an emergent property. Something as a simple as a simple IQ score can’t determine something as complex as intelligence. It’s like trying to judge the health of a person with blood pressure alone.

Now I am quite liberal and I believe in having the freedom express your opinions and doing research, but Rushton is not a real researcher - he is a pseudoscientist funded by racist organizations. ”——-Curious Indian

*** Individual examples-exceptions can be discredit IQ test. 

Yes, simple things CAN and ALWAYS determine something complex, as complex as intelligence. That´s the whole beauty of science, isn´t it?  With simple quartz watch alike computing power, high IQ people went to the Moon decades ago.  Yet with the help of billions of donations and countless sophitiscated int´l bodies around the world for decades, low IQ people of India and Sub Sahara Africa still live in mut huts on top of garbage piles. That´s all you need to know.

”  And Strategy, reaction time is by no means the same as processing power. It just measures how quickly you respond to something. The response itself may be preprogrammed.
An it is a hard thing to measure. For example, professional tennis players bypass the biological limits of reaction time by responding to the ball by following the opponents body movements.
Smilarly, while average digit-span is believed to be around 7 digits. By practicing properly for several years, one can extend the digit span to as high as 100 or even more. Similarly, a chess player can train himself to play bliindfold chess games. These are not general skills, but applies to very specific skills with a lot of practice. It’s called expert working memory, different from general working memory..

In general, the speed of decision making seems to depend on a substance called myelin. The more myelinated you brain connections are- the quicker you make decisions. however, the amount of myelination seems to be largely influenced by environment.
Not all parts of the brain are equally myelinated. The parts that you use more are myelinated more. Starting something like playing a musical instrument early may also result in greater myelination of the relevant connections.

And myelin may be a doubl-edged sword. While it may make you act fast, it may also make it harder to rewire the relevant connection - making you closed-minded or slave of a habit. ”——-Curious Indian

*** ....errr, seems right, unless you can provide solid evidences that 6-year-old kids or even much younger babies ( add any groupings of adults if you want) from high IQ countries who have been taking IQ tests have been specificly trained for Working Memory as you´ve accused, in order to fetch a faster reaction time than say kids/adults from low IQ countries such as India.

***Nothing to do with causation here as we are NOT dealing with the cause, yet.  IQ tests seperate 2 groups of people consistently.  Correlation implied is enough to tell this story.

@Dumb Indian/Big mouth, You have some great points and will be always fun to debate in an intelligent way not like that Chinese idiot who skips from one to another w/o keeping up the debate he cant answer. Hope you don’t do that
Your quote:-***Perhaps you don’t need a scientist, natural or social, to point out what’s the obvious, unless of course one has a 2-digit IQ part from curious? –

Statistics are always based on probability, they are tangible, and depends on a set of variable factors, they are not abstract. There are not yet any solid race-genetics based study.  Even the hap map project which carried out is basically intended for researchers to use the data for the studies pertaining to diseases rather than studying the IQ gaps in races.  IQ variations depend on the environments, classical examples are American Indians, American jews, and American blacks vs their own country. Suzuki is a Genius

Your quote:-*** The fact that no everyone (indeed not many) can be trained like Schwarzenegger or Usian Bolt contradicts your claim that working memory can be trained like muscles. And working memory (rote learning) is not g even by a long shot.  The logical fallacy is what you’re claiming that g= working memory= trained. 
*** ....errr, seems right, unless you can provide solid evidences that 6-year-old kids or even much younger babies ( add any groupings of adults if you want) from high IQ countries who have been taking IQ tests have been specificly trained for Working Memory as you´ve accused, in order to fetch a faster reaction time than say kids/adults from low IQ countries such as India.

There is a point what you say everyone cannot became a Schwarzenegger but how many Schwarzenegger’s are there? Same way How many Einstein’s are there? So Genius category will be always there in IQ too which cannot be trained. But everyone can be trained and develop a muscular body with workouts. So to get a 3 digit IQ from 2 digit can be done easily.  If you take the 200 million middle class ppl in India which is growing who has adopted the 2 child policy are all in 3 digit IQ categories . Even my own experience which I have restrained to expose so far was it may sound racial. My primary schooling was with Chinese, 80% were Chinese but not even one Chinese kid could stand even with in top 7. If you take mere statistics as you prefer then all of them has a low IQ, how can 80% have a low IQ ? Impossible right ?,

Chinese situation is different “Entire attention on one child from the parents in terms of nutrition, education etc cannot be denied as they have resorted to the one child policy, not due to low testosterone loading but due to government policy, Chinese and Indians both were notorious in testosterone load , evidence is in population. Rushton is wrong again
 
Memory is unlimited, Brain is the most plastic organ than anything, neuroplastry is the key to IQ enhancement. There are many cases that people are leading a normal life even after removing the most parts of the brain itself. Neural paths can be easily rewired
Your Quote:- Yes, simple things CAN and ALWAYS determine something complex, as complex as intelligence. That´s the whole beauty of science, isn´t it?  With simple quartz watch alike computing power, high IQ people went to the Moon decades ago.  Yet with the help of billions of donations and countless sophisticated int´l bodies around the world for decades, low IQ people of India and Sub Sahara Africa still live in mut huts on top of garbage piles. That´s all you need to know.

Statistics is not science man, Science is beautiful for sure but even science or mathematics has limitations as Godels theory proclaims it. There are self referral statements which are not even computable; Even Allen Turing has admitted it. The highest IQ ppl went to moon is true as always the notable scientists are in genius category, But mind their ancestors were living in a more muddy conditions in the Europe in the dark ages.,These people were ruled for more than 1000 years by Romans,due to low IQ ?. West became smart after renaissance only, Why due to IQ mutation or the over night renaissance? .Chinese ppl were also living in mud and were a set of dumb and poor ppl take 50’s, yet all are not still out from it.  Western civilization uplifted them with globalization; west build the entire infrastructure for China.  But everybody forgets that the base for moon mission is science, and the base for science is mathematics ( decimal / Binary systems both are the inventions of Indians, not like silly things as gun powder and paper ). Albert Einstein acknowledged this due to his unbiased and sensitive mind which recalls his greatness not only as a great scientist but also as a great personality.  In his own words “ We owe a lot to the Indians, who taught us how to count, without which no worthwhile scientific discovery could have been made”-Albert Einstein”. Obviously some one in his genius category can only acknowledge this as such ppl will also have a high EQ too. “If Indians had a patent on decimal system then India should have been the world Bank.

“Yes, simple things CAN and ALWAYS make something complex,ex:- decimal system. But simple things cannot determine complex things.

Take quantum mechanics, even string theory is failing. Determinism totally failed.  Brain is the most complex system, science is a child in front of it. Even genetics will not help as long as there are unpredictable factors due to freewill, brain capacity and plasticity unlike Turing systems which are predictable. that is why AI will be doomed to be failed.  The intelligence will be always be shrouded under mystery. How can you even think a simple statistical system can predict the most complex system the brain ……You don’t need to be a rocket scientist to infer such simple observation. If you reply try to stay in the subject unlike the other guy. You could not cut any of Curious Indians points, He may have another full set loaded for you…..........

@indian strategy
Thanks for the compliments, you seem better than what I thought, but I don’t think I have done anything wrong by defending my fellow countryman Astro.

I agree with your view that correlations may not always be useless, but they are never enough to show a causal relationship- no matter how high. And if you are being paid to announce highly offensive and highly useless study results without even having the need to establish a causal relationship - there is a need to be concerned. That’s what Suzuki said, basically. And there is no contradiction in what Suzuki said. Biologically race is not very meaningful, but there is obviously a social notion of race - people report themselves as belonging to some race.

If you ask Lewontin, he will tell you that Rushton has interpreted the r-k theory upside down. Graves will tell you that r-k theory is false entirely.

yes, vocabulary has high g-loading. The reason I avoided vocabulary is because it should be quite obvious that it has a cultural bias and someone motivated enough and having access to proper resources should be able to pick up new words. Like I said, an average educated Indian knows about 3 languages. From my observations, plenty of Indians from all social classes pick up new words much faster than I do and my own vocabulary isn’t that bad - I know several languages plus a few programming languages. If vocabulary is indeed an important measure, then I am almost certain that there is a cultural bias in tests if Indians don’t score high in some tests.

Many experts think that things like backward digit span which is closely related to working memory are closely related to g. And to me, it indeed seems if Indians indeed have some kind of deficit it’s more likely to be in working memory than vocabulary.To give an example, in India we have
10^3= thousand, 10^5 = Lakh, 10^7 = crore and so on.
In west, they have
10^3= thousand, 10^6 =million, 10^9= billion and so on
In Japan, they have
10^4= man, 10^8=oku, 10^12=choo and so on.
Notice the difference in increments. It seems that the Japanese, because of their system, are forced to remember chunks of 4 digits, whereas we Indians only need to remember chunks of 2 or 3.
Simple things like these, if experienced from early childhood, can actually make a difference in working memory.

About pre-programmed responses, even if you don’t know the exact question, there is always a difference in the degree of familiarity to certain sets of questions and that can make a big difference.

@BIG mouth

firstly, what we see is not necessarily what can be. I am not claiming that everyone can be as fast as Bolt, but I am quite sure that Bolt himself would not be Bolt without training.
secondly, I already mentioned a game which has produced results in improving working memory.Obviously, it can be trained.
thirdly, working memory =/= rote learning and plenty of experts believe that g is very closely related to working memory.
fourthly, my claim was closer to:
g= has close connections with working memory , not the most important thing , can be improved by training (just like muscles).

<Yes, simple things CAN and ALWAYS determine something complex, as complex as intelligence. That´s the whole beauty of science, isn´t it?  With simple quartz watch alike computing power, high IQ people went to the Moon decades ago.  Yet with the help of billions of donations and countless sophitiscated int´l bodies around the world for decades, low IQ people of India and Sub Sahara Africa still live in mut huts on top of garbage piles. That´s all you need to know.>
Do you even know what a complex system means? If not, please don’t display you ignorance.
Is that why the best experts can’t predict the weather 10 days ahead? Or can’t predict the stock market for next month?And in fact, our best prediction methods are based on computer simulations and complex calculations - NOT SIMPLE LAWS. And an IQ score is merely a simple measure, not even a law like the law of universal gravitation. It can hardly tell anything.
There is a reason why they call it complexity science - there are no KNOWN simple laws. And in fact, in complexity science they say something similar to “a butterfly flapping its wings in a country like India can cause an F5 tornado in your country”. If I were you, I will never underestimate Indian butterflies or African mosquitoes. Nor will I underestimate the complexity of intelligence. And BTW, you didn’t go to moon, did you?? That’s all you need to know.

<errr, seems right, unless you can provide solid evidences that 6-year-old kids or even much younger babies ( add any groupings of adults if you want) from high IQ countries who have been taking IQ tests have been specificly trained for Working Memory as you´ve accused, in order to fetch a faster reaction time than say kids/adults from low IQ countries such as India>
Can you provide solid evidence that these 6 year olds never got any necessary training? Perhaps certain environments put greater demand on working memory right from birth?  And how exactly do you test for working memory of little babies? Can you provide solid evidence that a 6 year old will definitely respond a certain way if you just tell them to? Can you provide solid evidence that they will never disobey you or not take the test correctly?

@Astro
BIG mouth is by no means any better than strategy, you are being way too nice to him. The language he uses is probably worse. He is obviously a racist.

BTW, you probably know ,but not all godel statements are based on just self-reference, some are based on infinities. In fact, one Turing’s proof is based on the fact that countable infinity is not the same as uncountable infinity.

I am reposting the big-mouth portion because the reference comments did not appear.

@BIG mouth
Perhaps you don’t need a scientist, natural or social, to point out what’s the obvious, unless of course one has a 2-digit IQ part from curious?

Or perhaps what needs to pointed out depends a bit on the culture you are a part of? And did I hit a nerve here by pointing out the obvious?/ Does the obvious truth hurt? Why?

The fact that no everyone (indeed not many) can be trained like Schwarznigger or Usian Bolt contradicts your claim that working memory can be trained like muscles. And working memory (rote learning) is not g even by a long shot.  The logical fallacy is what you’re claiming that g= working memory= trained
.
firstly, what we see is not necessarily what can be. I am not claiming that everyone can be as fast as Bolt, but I am quite sure that Bolt himself would not be Bolt without training.
secondly, I already mentioned a game which has produced results in improving working memory.Obviously, it can be trained.
thirdly, working memory =/= rote learning and plenty of experts believe that g is very closely related to working memory.
fourthly, my claim was closer to:
g= has close connections with working memory , not the most important thing , can be improved by training (just like muscles).

Yes, simple things CAN and ALWAYS determine something complex, as complex as intelligence. That´s the whole beauty of science, isn´t it?  With simple quartz watch alike computing power, high IQ people went to the Moon decades ago.  Yet with the help of billions of donations and countless sophitiscated int´l bodies around the world for decades, low IQ people of India and Sub Sahara Africa still live in mut huts on top of garbage piles. That´s all you need to know.
Do you even know what a complex system means? If not, please don’t display you ignorance.
Is that why the best experts can’t predict the weather 10 days ahead? Or can’t predict the stock market for next month?And in fact, our best prediction methods are based on computer simulations and complex calculations - NOT SIMPLE LAWS. And an IQ score is merely a simple measure, not even a law like the law of universal gravitation. It can hardly tell anything.
There is a reason why they call it complexity science - there are no KNOWN simple laws. And in fact, in complexity science they say something similar to “a butterfly flapping its wings in a country like India can cause an F5 tornado in your country”. If I were you, I will never underestimate Indian butterflies or African mosquitoes. Nor will I underestimate the complexity of intelligence. And BTW, you didn’t go to moon, did you?? That’s all you need to know.

errr, seems right, unless you can provide solid evidences that 6-year-old kids or even much younger babies ( add any groupings of adults if you want) from high IQ countries who have been taking IQ tests have been specificly trained for Working Memory as you´ve accused, in order to fetch a faster reaction time than say kids/adults from low IQ countries such as India
Can you provide solid evidence that these 6 year olds never got any necessary training? Perhaps certain cultures and environments put greater demand on working memory right from birth?  And how exactly do you test for working memory of little babies? Can you provide solid evidence that a 6 year old will definitely respond a certain way if you just tell them to? Can you provide solid evidence that they will never disobey you or not take the test correctly?

Astro:

—-Statistics are always based on probability, they are tangible, and depends on a set of variable factors, they are not abstract. There are not yet any solid race-genetics based study.  Even the hap map project which carried out is basically intended for researchers to use the data for the studies pertaining to diseases rather than studying the IQ gaps in races.  IQ variations depend on the environments, classical examples are American Indians, American jews, and American blacks vs their own country. Suzuki is a Genius—-

***  Excuse me, but I am not used to argue with double-digit IQers as I usually loss patience due to that fact that I don’t know from where to start correcting them…just countless dumb claims one after another….  Oke, that you don’t see race-based genetics doesn’t mean they don’t exist. Many race-based genetics are there, for ages, yet they are censored by mainstream media.  “classical examples” you raised are in fact classic fallacies which can be easily refuted as they have been numerous times.  Suzuki is a liberal idiot btw, to put it mildly.

——There is a point what you say everyone cannot became a Schwarzenegger but how many Schwarzenegger’s are there? Same way How many Einstein’s are there? So Genius category will be always there in IQ too which cannot be trained. But everyone can be trained and develop a muscular body with workouts. So to get a 3 digit IQ from 2 digit can be done easily.  If you take the 200 million middle class ppl in India which is growing who has adopted the 2 child policy are all in 3 digit IQ categories . Even my own experience which I have restrained to expose so far was it may sound racial. My primary schooling was with Chinese, 80% were Chinese but not even one Chinese kid could stand even with in top 7. If you take mere statistics as you prefer then all of them has a low IQ, how can 80% have a low IQ ? Impossible right ?,—-

***oh my, you still don’t get it, do you? My Schwarzenegger analogy has nothing to do with “how many”, but “how to become”…

***India has 200m middleclass? What’s the definition of Indian middleclass?  “Own 1 mobile phone, a coloured TV and a 3-wheel (or more) vehicle” according to Indian govt.  By the same definition, there are probably 200 million plus middle class in prosperous superpower Sub Sahara Africa as well….

***As for your primary school example, in my primary school and high school, almost all top 5 were ethnic Chinese… your point is?

—- Chinese situation is different “Entire attention on one child from the parents in terms of nutrition, education etc cannot be denied as they have resorted to the one child policy, not due to low testosterone loading but due to government policy, Chinese and Indians both were notorious in testosterone load , evidence is in population. Rushton is wrong again——-

*** Genetically the Chinese are drastically different from the Indians.  In fact they are almost mirror images as the Whites and the Blacks. Only SOME Indians from Northeast India have relatively low testosterone (then again, Indians by and large don’t have evolutionarily advanced features that East Asians have) due to admixture with their Mongol conquers several hundred years ago. Vast majority of Indian have High testosterone instead.  It proves that Rushton is right. 

 
—-Memory is unlimited, Brain is the most plastic organ than anything, neuroplastry is the key to IQ enhancement. There are many cases that people are leading a normal life even after removing the most parts of the brain itself. Neural paths can be easily rewired—-

***… “brain part removal”, “easy neural path rewiring” ? where? In India?  Perhaps after those operations, you could give me a ring to have a drink…

—-Statistics is not science man, Science is beautiful for sure but even science or mathematics has limitations as Godels theory proclaims it. There are self referral statements which are not even computable; Even Allen Turing has admitted it.—-

*** Statistics is one of the most important tools of modern sciences.  Godels and Turing…what they have anything to do with discrediting stats ?

—-The highest IQ ppl went to moon is true as always the notable scientists are in genius category, But mind their ancestors were living in a more muddy conditions in the Europe in the dark ages.,These people were ruled for more than 1000 years by Romans,due to low IQ ?.—-

*** warm climate is one of the key reasons for jump-starting ancient agrarian economies. How early one had an agrarian economy has little to do with one’s IQ. In warm climates such as India and Sub-sahara Africa, you drop a seed carelessly today and forget it, it will grow into a fruit tree tomorrow.  Yet both India and Africa have been major food importers and the UN food aid recipients for decades… No surprise there.

—-West became smart after renaissance only, Why due to IQ mutation or the over night renaissance? .——

*** Black Death curled a large section of lower class +  huge infusion of advanced Chinese tech through Chinese/Arab merchant fleet/s in Italy + competitive and free social/economical environments… , based on already high average IQ of indigenous Europeans.

—-Chinese ppl were also living in mud and were a set of dumb and poor ppl take 50’s, yet all are not still out from it.  Western civilization uplifted them with globalization; west build the entire infrastructure for China. —-

***Yet with the same globalisation, and with more investments, worldwide large scale donations and the UN Food Aids for decades, India and Sub-Sahara Africa haven’t been lifted by the West even under democratic rules.  How come the Chinese made it and India/Africa failed?

—-But everybody forgets that the base for moon mission is science, and the base for science is mathematics ( decimal / Binary systems both are the inventions of Indians, not like silly things as gun powder and paper ). Albert Einstein acknowledged this due to his unbiased and sensitive mind which recalls his greatness not only as a great scientist but also as a great personality.  In his own words “ We owe a lot to the Indians, who taught us how to count, without which no worthwhile scientific discovery could have been made”-Albert Einstein”.——

*** Einstein was drunk and tried to be PC.  Chimps knew how to count bananas long before the Indians did, didn’t they?

——Obviously some one in his genius category can only acknowledge this as such ppl will also have a high EQ too. “If Indians had a patent on decimal system then India should have been the world Bank.
“Yes, simple things CAN and ALWAYS make something complex,ex:- decimal system. But simple things cannot determine complex things.—-

***Many countries, China for example In I’Çhing, claim invented decimal system long before India.  The fact that Indians have big mouthes compensates for their dismal brain power.  Well, God is fair.

 
——-Take quantum mechanics, even string theory is failing. Determinism totally failed.  Brain is the most complex system, science is a child in front of it. Even genetics will not help as long as there are unpredictable factors due to freewill, brain capacity and plasticity unlike Turing systems which are predictable. that is why AI will be doomed to be failed.  The intelligence will be always be shrouded under mystery. How can you even think a simple statistical system can predict the most complex system the brain ……You don’t need to be a rocket scientist to infer such simple observation——-

***Determinism totally failed only according to you? 

***A simple statistical system CAN predict complex star formations and the beyond in galaxies billions light years away, let alone the tiny brain of yours…

—— If you reply try to stay in the subject unlike the other guy. You could not cut any of Curious Indians points,  He may have another full set loaded for you—-

***after Hindu “brain part removal” and “easy neural path rewiring”, perhaps?

Curious Indian, you obviously know absolutely nothing about the experiments in the US, otherwise you wouldn’t ask for solid proofs. IQ can not be improved, that was the final conclusion of all the experiments in America.

http://www.arthurhu.com/index/aintell.htm

@@Abecedarian Project

IF YOU PUMP $10,000 A YEAR INTO POOR BABIES, THEY’LL GAIN 5 IQ POINTS
BY AGE 15, AND YOU’LL “PREVENT POVERTY”

This study claims that if you pump lots of money into poor kids at
birth, you can improve IQ at levels that stick around even at age 15,
compared to Head Start which starts at 3 to 5, and generally fades
out in an IQ gap. Note that even this study after 15 years has
subjects with an IQ of 94 which is still below average, and only 5
points above the control group, at a cost approaching $10,000 per
child for the first 5 years of life when most rich kids don’t get any
formal schooling at all except from their parents.

ABCEDARIAN CLAIMS PRESCHOOL FIXES IQ WITHOUT FADE-OUT
“What it might take to defeat poverty: A North Carolina Program that
starts teaching at birth is based on the idea that preventing the
setbacks of poverty is more effective than trying to compensate for
them” Seattle Times Dec 5, 1996 A3 Richard Whitmire. Study with
subjects now 21, concludes that IQ can be changed, but Head Start
starts way too late at 3 to 5, it must start in the first months of
life with trained experts. [ mothers are obviously not good enough]
Craig Ramey oversaw Abecedarian and another $33 million experiment on
low birthweight children. That program raised IQs by 13 points.
Godfrey Oakley ran a $2.5M program based on ab. methods. CDC proposed
$10,000 per year, $300 million over 5 years but shot down by Clinton.
z45\clipim\2000\10\14\abced.efx abced1.gif

IQ DIFFERENCES DID NOT STICK, BUT KIDS DID BETTER IN LIFE IQ
differences disappeared as kids aged in Mich. project Richard
Whitemire Gannett News seattle Times Dec 15, 1996 A3 High/Scope Perry
Preschool Study tracked 123 poor black children for 27 years. “Only”
7 percent of program group had been arrested vs 35% of the control
group. 4x earned $2,000 or more a month, 3x owned homes, fewer
received welfare, marriages lasted twice as long, females had fewer
out of wedlock babies. Claims that the program saved society $7 for
every $1 in cost. However, IQ differences washed out by age 10

IQ differences vs control group
3.0 84.27 100.70
3.5 93.04 102.96
4.0 89.19 101.22
4.5 91.09 101.22
5.0 93.82 101.43
6.5 92.26   98.45
7.0 91.82   98.12
8.0 93.33   97.83
12.0 88.44 93.74
15.0 90.34 94.98

Claim - differences did not fade completely, but 15 point gap has
narrowed to less than 5 points.

NY TIMES SAYS ABECEDARIAN WORKS
http://www.nytimes.com/library/national/102299early-childhood-edu.html
New York Times October 22, 1999 Quality Day Care, Early, Is Tied to
Achievements as an Adult.  The Abecedarian Project involved 111
African-American families in Chapel Hill, N.C., whose infants were
medically healthy but, demographically, at risk for failure 35% vs
15% in 4 yr college. 30% vs 56% repeat grade, over 19 vs 17 child,
below avg test scores, iq gap 17 at age 3, 5 pts by age 21

NEWSWEEK: ABECEDARIAN SHOWS GAINS AT AGE 15 VS HEAD START
Craig Ramey of the University of Alabama in 1972 launched the
Abecedarian Project.  Children enrolled in this program from ages
ranging from 4 months up to 8 years were found to still score higher
in math and reading at age 15 than the untreated, with an average
retained IQ advantage of 4.6 points, with earlier treatment lasting
longer.  Intervention after age 5 showed no benefits. “Your Child’s
Brain ” Newsweek Feb 19, 1996 p. 61

LOL ,Chinese claiming high IQ with stupid statistics.Can anyone name any chinese / east asian genius scientist or mathematician?.Most of their Inventions are just random discoveries,that too discovered over a long period.Most of them are insignificant too.They have no solid scientific proofs.Their mathematic contributions are just pathetic.What do chinese have today?.Only third rate copy paste stuff,with technology stolen from european countries.

@ Big mouth Oh god, I think these Chinese IQ figures are manipulated, as there are controversy on this , could be true that is what I am getting from your answers

***oh my, you still don’t get it, do you? My Schwarzenegger analogy has nothing to do with “how many”, but “how to become”…

We are talking about how many ” Average IQ level ” of countries implies numbers right ?. how to become is by enhancing,economy, literacy, nutrition etc. Genetics only plays when it comes to Genius, Artists, poets, musicians, athletes etc which are born and spread across races which only fit into what you say. Doctors and Engineers can be made not born.

***India has 200m middleclass? What’s the definition of Indian middleclass?  “Own 1 mobile phone, a coloured TV and a 3-wheel (or more) vehicle” according to Indian govt.  By the same definition, there are probably 200 million plus middle class in prosperous superpower Sub Sahara Africa as well….

Oh god that is not what I meant, I am talking about the middle class IQ level in India.

***As for your primary school example, in my primary school and high school, almost all top 5 were ethnic Chinese… your point is?

That is ok anybody can say anything, I talked the truth - my experience , you your experience,  this cannot be disputed so leave it.

*** Statistics is one of the most important tools of modern sciences.  Godels and Turing…what they have anything to do with discrediting stats ?

***Many countries, China for example In I’Çhing, claim invented decimal system long before India.  The fact that Indians have big mouthes compensates for their dismal brain power.  Well, God is fair.

Get proofs we will have a party with a Chinese girl

Yes man statistics is only a tool not science, google about Godel incompleteness theorem even applicable to mathematics, then let alone statistics, if you have an average IQ then you will get it.

—-The highest IQ ppl went to moon is true as always the notable scientists are in genius category, But mind their ancestors were living in a more muddy conditions in the Europe in the dark ages.,These people were ruled for more than 1000 years by Romans,due to low IQ ?.—-

*** warm climate is one of the key reasons for jump-starting ancient agrarian economies. How early one had an agrarian economy has little to do with one’s IQ. In warm climates such as India and Sub-sahara Africa, you drop a seed carelessly today and forget it, it will grow into a fruit tree tomorrow.  Yet both India and Africa have been major food importers and the UN food aid recipients for decades… No surprise there.

This is not the answer, both Romans and Europeans lived in same conditions - that is why I said IQ has nothing to do with intelligence , your answer itself proofs it.

—-West became smart after renaissance only, Why due to IQ mutation or the over night renaissance? .——

*** Black Death curled a large section of lower class +  huge infusion of advanced Chinese tech through Chinese/Arab merchant fleet/s in Italy + competitive and free social/economical environments… , based on already high average IQ of indigenous Europeans.

Ha ha ha-Europeans got it from Arabs who intern got it from Indians - You are making your own history Get some proofs for this we will have a second party with 2 Chinese girls man

***Yet with the same globalisation, and with more investments, worldwide large scale donations and the UN Food Aids for decades, India and Sub-Sahara Africa haven’t been lifted by the West even under democratic rules.  How come the Chinese made it and India/Africa failed?

Who said India failed ? India is the 3rd largest economy, mind India is only 1/3rd in size of China, don’t act dumb. What is the place of Africa in GDP do you know ? Sudan has the highest GDP in Africa which is in the 69th place, Why this idiotic comparison with Africa?.awake, I thought you are more smarter ?

*** Einstein was drunk and tried to be PC.  Chimps knew how to count bananas long before the Indians did, didn’t they?

Einstein was drunk? that is how he got theory of relativity & special relativity ? wow see the Chinese brain!!!!!!!!!, you are becoming a chimp now, Yes except Indians everyone was only counting bananas like chimps, nobody could even imagine in millions and billions and in decimals and fractions, complex numbers etc and higher maths,

Indian mathematicians made early contributions to the study of the concept of zero as a number,[5] negative numbers,[6] arithmetic, and algebra.[7] In addition, trigonometry[8] was further advanced in India, and, in particular, the modern definitions of sine and cosine, complex numbers, Linear equations were developed there.[9] These mathematical concepts were transmitted to the Middle East, China, and Europe[7] and led to further developments that now form the foundations of many areas of mathematics. not just counting - Google it

***A simple statistical system CAN predict complex star formations and the beyond in galaxies billions light years away, let alone the tiny brain of yours…

Why a statistical system cant even predict a weather accurately? then let alone star formations

Why a statistical system cant even predict a stock market ? Human behavioral patterns play a great role here - learn about “free will ” - Curious Indian has good points here.

You still didn’t get it brain is the most complex organ than any star formation, because consciousness is expressed through brain, w/o consciousness nothing makes sense, that is what the tiny brain do mmmmh

Chinese pictorial character based language enhances the spacial IQ may be true with a trade off in verbal IQ is again a mix and match. it is again an environmental situation…...that is all I have to say man

your own Chinese news follow the below link

china becoming low IQ

@ Big mouth, Sorry the earlier Link didnt work. Your own Chinese TV, watch this please !!!!!!!!!!!

Chinese IQ is shrinking